Carte de Sejour Card / Residency Card

Donna Said

Well-Known Member
#41
I had to wait 8 months for my carte de sejour but I found Hammamet .police very helpful
 

Essem

Moderator
Staff member
#42
With reference to the CDS, when it comes to selling your property as a resident, if you have stayed in Tunisia for more than 180 days in any one year, you will have to declare any money transferred in during that year and perhaps pay tax on it (unless you can prove that you have paid taxes in the UK or wherever you are resident).

Doesn't matter if you're selling property or not, over 180 day as a resident and it's up to you to go pay your taxes - n.b. they don't send out demands.


If you can't prove tax paid on your money in another country, I believe their is a an amount, like a annual personal allowance of around 7000 dt (amount to be confirmed) so less than that coming in wouldn't be taxable.
Not so - Up to date details - See table below


Proof of residency in the UK or your country of residence will also be required ie title deeds to property, bank statements with addresses, voter's role, etc British passport is not enough.

These are required in order to have the Ministry of Finance/Hôtel des finances/Kabadha issue a document that goes in with the application to the governor for authorisation to sell. I'm in the middle of this at the moment so information is up to date.

I first applied for a CDS in 2002 when it was a requirement for buying a car here or even to have a Telecom land line. I believe it no longer applies to either but don't know when the laws changed. So a good idea you keep up with all the current laws etc although word is that it'll all change again after the elections.

And, of course, every time you exit Tunisia as a resident you have to pay 60dt (previously 45dt). So even with the new 30dt exit stamp, it's still cheaper to be non resident.

So only benefits that I can see for having a CDS now is that it allows you to remain in the country for more than 3 months at any one time without having to leave and it allows you to do certain types of work here.

It would appear from discussions I've had recently that non residents who own and then sell property, can transfer money back without any of the above hassle - but I'm not convinced.

There is a double taxation convention between the UK and Tunisia, and info about this can be found on google.

So I'd say that if you have a CDS and you don't really need it, cancel it.

**Okay well it would appear that even with a double taxation convention and proof of paying tax in another country, that all goes for nothing. I've just been hit with two bills for two years that I exceeded 180 days as a resident.

I had to prove I was resident in the UK, had a home in the UK, had had a business in the UK with start and finish dates, proof of having paid taxes, the list seemed endless and they always wanted something else.

There is no personal allowance as such, but there is a scale of charges.

They are:

From the total amount of monies transferred in, deduct 2.5% and the balance left is taxable.

%ges on the balance are as follows:

0 - 1500dt - 0%
1500.001 - 5000dt - 15%
5000.001 - 10.000 - 20%
10.000.001 - 20.000 - 25%
20.000.001 - 50.000 - 30%
50.000 - super tax bracket (I think, it's in arabic) - 35% **

From ** to ** has taken me nearly 7 weeks, patience is a necessity.

[It didn't help that my bank took 9 days to type up an attestation for me, which realistically only took 15 mins to do but 3 trips and several phone calls to achieve].

The amounts due have to be paid to your local Tax Office. They will give you a receipt which has then to go with the rest of the docs to the main Tax Office in Sousse (who will decide if the above is enough or not!!). To be continued.......
 

Scottochott

Well-Known Member
#43
**Okay well it would appear that even with a double taxation convention and proof of paying tax in another country, that all goes for nothing. I've just been hit with two bills for two years that I exceeded 180 days as a resident.

I had to prove I was resident in the UK, had a home in the UK, had had a business in the UK with start and finish dates, proof of having paid taxes, the list seemed endless and they always wanted something else.

There is no personal allowance as such, but there is a scale of charges.

They are:

From the total amount of monies transferred in, deduct 2.5% and the balance left is taxable.

%ges on the balance are as follows:

0 - 1500dt - 0%
1500.001 - 5000dt - 15%
5000.001 - 10.000 - 20%
10.000.001 - 20.000 - 25%
20.000.001 - 50.000 - 30%
50.000 - super tax bracket (I think, it's in arabic) - 35% **

From ** to ** has taken me nearly 7 weeks, patience is a necessity.

[It didn't help that my bank took 9 days to type up an attestation for me, which realistically only took 15 mins to do but 3 trips and several phone calls to achieve].

The amounts due have to be paid to your local Tax Office. They will give you a receipt which has then to go with the rest of the docs to the main Tax Office in Sousse (who will decide if the above is enough or not!!). To be continued.......
What instigated their demand? Was it CDS renewal, or something to do with property sale? Or a demand out of the blue?
 

Essem

Moderator
Staff member
#44
BTW one of the years, I'd transferred more money than usual to repair my car and that can't be offset as expenses against tax due (worth a try!)

CDS = a license to print money
 

Essem

Moderator
Staff member
#45
What instigated their demand? Was it CDS renewal, or something to do with property sale? Or a demand out of the blue?
It was property sale and if you don't pay your tax due, you can't submit documents for authorisation to sell.

They don't send out demands apparently.

Not knowing anyone who has sold here (legally that is - and hindsight is 20/20 vision :rolleyes:), it's all been a huge learning curve.
 

Scottochott

Well-Known Member
#46
Thank god I'm not resident any more! I've never stayed 180 days in a year anyway so presumably that would also mean nothing is payable.

So what about people who rent, would they be liable? How would anyone know if they owed tax and how would they be charged?

Doesn't really make the country an attractive option does it?
 

Essem

Moderator
Staff member
#47
Exactly. They treat you like criminals TBH, attitudes not good especially with some of the women in middle management positions. They forget that what 'we' bring in goes a long way to paying their wages.

It's been so frustrating getting thus far, trying to keep calm and collected. However, there will be a few letters of complaint sent to head offices when the time is right.
 

Essem

Moderator
Staff member
#48
Thank god I'm not resident any more! I've never stayed 180 days in a year anyway so presumably that would also mean nothing is payable.

So what about people who rent, would they be liable? How would anyone know if they owed tax and how would they be charged?

Doesn't really make the country an attractive option does it?
Yes, less than 180 days, nothing to pay. I'd imagine people who rent are liable if they are resident and are there for more than 180 days in any one year. It wasn't till I started the selling process that I found all of this out.

The fact that their system is one where you have to go to them and ask because they don;t send out demands is ludicrous because if you're not aware of these laws, as I wasn't, how do you know. No handbook! It's when you go to sell that the can of worms is opened.

I had accountants help me complete the form yesterday and they calculated for 2012, 1514 dt and 2013, 99 - both with fines because I am late in paying something I didn't know I had to.

So went to local tax office this morning and the guy asked me who calculated the amounts. Told him and he said they were incorrect and had miscalculated.

The above charges/tables I posted are correct for Tunisians not foreigners. I was waiting for the worst/an increase but was over the moon when he said for 2012 I should pay 182dt and 2013 1dt 500 millimes. I didn't ask any more questions, just paid and left in case they changed their minds.

A fraction of what I was told and a pittance really but it's the principle of the thing when you are bringing money in to spend/live here and you're taxed on it, already having been taxed on it before it got here.

So outcome,
If you owe any taxes, go straight to your local tax office and they will work out what is due;
Make sure you know the tax laws and keep up to date with them (although how one finds out what's correct is beyond me).

For CDS you have to have a certain amount of money coming in every month or year, it was around 12000 dt.

Tax people know that you have to have this amount in order to get a CDS, so if you are resident and living there full time (or longer than 180 days in one year), it might be an idea to keep a bank account solely for the CDS declarations and have another for anything over and above that you bring in. That way, showing only one account to them, they can only tax you on the CDS amounts, max 12,000 or whatever it's set to in any one year.

Does this make sense?

I am at present lying down in a darkened room.
 
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janette

Well-Known Member
#49
Total and utter nightmare springs to mind -- you must be so relieved to see freedom waving to you on the horizon!
 

Aslemma

Well-Known Member
#50
What a relief that you've finally got it sorted and things can now move forward Essem. The system certainly does nothing to encourage investment , at least in property.
 

Scottochott

Well-Known Member
#51
I think the key thing is to remain non resident, and spend less than 180 days there. But let's see what changes with the new government...
 

Essem

Moderator
Staff member
#52
Total and utter nightmare springs to mind -- you must be so relieved to see freedom waving to you on the horizon!
What a relief that you've finally got it sorted and things can now move forward Essem. The system certainly does nothing to encourage investment , at least in property.
Too good to be true.:(

Next day, my lawyer called me to say he'd gone to lodge the rest of the papers at the Tax office in Sousse. They said the amount was wrong and that the guy in HS tax office must have made a mistake and how did he arrive at these figures!!! :wtf: Laywer suggested they check their computer system to find this out as all info is saved there :banghead:

They also asked for more papers from the UK so at this point he went ballistic and said we'd lose the sale if this constant asking for more paperwork continued (we won't because of the terms and conditions I set out :D). I have since supplied them with the rest of the papers (good job I'm a bit AR and have all details to hand) so, as far as I know, papers have been lodged in order to get the Quitus (full and final discharge) which 'should' be through in one week, and then we can apply for authorisation to sell, which, under the new laws should take 3 months to come through. Not holding my breath...........................

Stress doesn't even cover it. What a roller coaster. Fortunately, my lawyer has been absolutely amazing, on the ball and has managed to keep me sane - well saner than usual :p
 

Aslemma

Well-Known Member
#53
It's been an absolute nightmare right from the beginning Essem but thank goodness you've got a good lawyer who's actually on the ball. It's also good that you've got a good contract in place so the buyer can't simply walk away without losing out.

Let's hope that you get the Quitus before you return to the UK as that should mean things can finally move forward,. though you've been let down so often that I know you won't be able to relax until it has actually come through.
 

Trulymadlydeeply

Well-Known Member
#54
I'm out of breath just reading that, what a complete load of utter BS!!! Bet you will be so relieved when its all over.

PS Santorini looks devine ;)
 

Jane BM

Well-Known Member
#55
I'm out of breath just reading that, what a complete load of utter BS!!! Bet you will be so relieved when its all over.

PS Santorini looks devine ;)
Yeah you can count me in on that one...lol...:p
 

Jane BM

Well-Known Member
#56
Too good to be true.:(

Next day, my lawyer called me to say he'd gone to lodge the rest of the papers at the Tax office in Sousse. They said the amount was wrong and that the guy in HS tax office must have made a mistake and how did he arrive at these figures!!! :wtf: Laywer suggested they check their computer system to find this out as all info is saved there :banghead:

They also asked for more papers from the UK so at this point he went ballistic and said we'd lose the sale if this constant asking for more paperwork continued (we won't because of the terms and conditions I set out :D). I have since supplied them with the rest of the papers (good job I'm a bit AR and have all details to hand) so, as far as I know, papers have been lodged in order to get the Quitus (full and final discharge) which 'should' be through in one week, and then we can apply for authorisation to sell, which, under the new laws should take 3 months to come through. Not holding my breath...........................

Stress doesn't even cover it. What a roller coaster. Fortunately, my lawyer has been absolutely amazing, on the ball and has managed to keep me sane - well saner than usual :p
So once you've received the authorisation to sell, is it 'relatively' straightforward from then on in....I know, I know...it's Tunisia....but SHOULD it be quick then or is it still a long drawn out process?
 

Essem

Moderator
Staff member
#57
AS far as I know, it should then be straightforward. (Unless they say 'no'). We then sign final contract and I have given buyer 15 days to complete. If he doesn't pay or go through with contract, I keep his deposit (luckily, I have 2 other buyers who would step in, so won't lose either way).

Then it's trying to repatriate funds. I know of at least 4 lots of people who have been waiting more than 2years to do so. So, in effect, they have sold up, are back in their countries and money stuck in Tunisia.

I did everything the correct way for the buying process so we'll just have to wait and see :rolleyes:
 

Kris

Administrator
Staff member
#58
I would think if you know 4 people you can raise the issue with the embassy.

If there are trade agreements etc that ensure investors get their money back.

Also its not right to say one thing and then do another
 

janette

Well-Known Member
#59
Utter, total and complete chaos and why should I expect anything different? Why on earth cannot the people here get their act together and simply do things the correct way the first time.? Despite the years living here, I just do not understand the mind set of the people. Chaos accepted as the norm -- papers waved about accompanied by yelling and gestures of anger and frustration and then a shrug of the shoulders from the powers that be -- and that is that until another day. I really do feel for you Essen :arghh:
 

janette

Well-Known Member
#60
Utter, total and complete chaos and why should I expect anything different? Why on earth cannot the people here get their act together and simply do things the correct way the first time.? Despite the years living here, I just do not understand the mind set of the people. Chaos accepted as the norm -- papers waved about accompanied by yelling and gestures of anger and frustration and then a shrug of the shoulders from the powers that be -- and that is that until another day. I really do feel for you Essen :arghh:
 
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